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Arrested tonite cuz I knew the law better than the cop

Marc

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 22, 2010
Messages
184
Location
St. Joseph, Missouri, USA
I was sitting on my porch tonite with a couple of friends, drinking a few beers. I was of course open carrying and we seen the cops swarming the block. Watched a guy run down the alley a block away and the patrol car that wasw half a block over seen him and chased him down the alley. We heard the cop yell freeze, so we went down to be lookieloos. Officer Joe Herrera comes up behind us and says "Hey guys I want to talk to you for a minute" so we stopped and started answering his questions about what we saw, then he seen my gun and asked "Is that a pistol on ur belt?" i said yes it is, he then says ur under arrest, i saked why he says ur carrying a gun while intoxicated thats a felony. I then informed him it wasnt illegal at all as of August 28 2010. He tells me well u can tell that to the judge, i replied i will and the judge will back me up. At that point i asked him to get his supervisor out there. The supervisor shows up and looks up the revised statute and says im good. Officer Herrera dont like that i outwitted him on the law and arrests me for drinking in a public way. When we get to the booking desk Herrera is telling Officer Caleb Carter about the chase and Carter says "So u arrested this poor guy instead?" Herrera tells him well he was carrying a firearm and drinking, Carter says nothing illegal there, so Herrera comes back with he was drinking while walking on the street. Cost me a hundred bucks to get out of jail, but I also educated a veteran cop on the laws. He only arrested me cuz i proved him wrong in front of his colleagues, so i was smilin the whole way downtown and i was still smiling when my brothe showed up with the rest of the bail money before they were even done booking me in. Put a cramp in my night but now one more leo knows a bit more about the laws he is enforcing.

oh and becuz its a holiday i have to wait til wednesday to get my gun back, so now i think im probly gonna have a bersa 380 for sale cuz i dont wanna keep it after they got ahold of it
 
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fjpro2a

Regular Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2010
Messages
280
Location
North Carolina
Discipline the LEO

It is Officer Joe Herrara who should be disciplined,and maybe fined. Perhaps, he should even offer an apology to you in front of a camera. Sometimes, I think we are NEVER going to get our rights back. I hope I am wrong.
 

9026543

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2009
Messages
509
Location
Southern MO
Still think that Sgt Smith, Officer Tonn and now officer Joe Herrera should be invited to the St Joe meet and greet and eat meeting.
 

cshoff

Regular Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
687
Location
, Missouri, USA
A few questions that come to my mind:

1. Were you, indeed, "intoxicated"? Were you in a substantially impaired mental of physical capacity?

2. What criteria did the officer use to determine your "intoxicated" condition? Did he give you any indication that he noticed you slurring your words, staggering around, or some other physical indication that you were intoxicated, or did he just assume you were because you had a beer in your hand?

3. What municipal code did you violate by drinking an alcoholic beverage on a public street/sidewalk/whatever it was you were standing on at the time?
 

EricDailey X-NRA

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2011
Messages
209
Location
Wake County, NC
Voice Recorder?

I was sitting on my porch tonite with a couple of friends, drinking a few beers. I was of course open carrying and we seen the cops swarming the block. Watched a guy run down the alley a block away and the patrol car that wasw half a block over seen him and chased him down the alley. We heard the cop yell freeze, so we went down to be lookieloos. Officer Joe Herrera comes up behind us and says ...


Cool story bro. This is why all OC / CC should have a USB downloadable Digital Voice Recorder. Mine rides in my shirt pocket or in reach 24/7. I switch it on as needed cause it eats batteries but I always have my little silicone witness.
 

Big Boy

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
443
Location
STL, MO
If I were you I would be fighting this big time. What municipal code did he actually charge you with breaking?

And were you not being detained by him in the roadway? So it's his fault you were standing there, not yours. Surely there is no law against crossing the street to a neighbors house with a beer in hand.
 

Big Boy

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
443
Location
STL, MO
The way that law is written you couldn't even carry a six pack over to your neighbors....fricking ridiculous.
 

JDW

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2009
Messages
26
Location
Mo
It says ''drink or consume '' nothing about carrying it .
 

Marc

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 22, 2010
Messages
184
Location
St. Joseph, Missouri, USA
A few questions that come to my mind:

1. Were you, indeed, "intoxicated"? Were you in a substantially impaired mental of physical capacity?

2. What criteria did the officer use to determine your "intoxicated" condition? Did he give you any indication that he noticed you slurring your words, staggering around, or some other physical indication that you were intoxicated, or did he just assume you were because you had a beer in your hand?

3. What municipal code did you violate by drinking an alcoholic beverage on a public street/sidewalk/whatever it was you were standing on at the time?

I was in no way intoxicated and when he realized that, he said i was lucky because the law is grey on that part, if i was intoxicated he said i could be charged with carry ing a firearm in a dangerous manner. And of course the code has now already been posted on the having a beer. But when you carry all the time i guess you just get used to the cops messing with you. Thats life I guess.
 

cshoff

Regular Member
Joined
May 20, 2010
Messages
687
Location
, Missouri, USA
I was in no way intoxicated and when he realized that, he said i was lucky because the law is grey on that part, if i was intoxicated he said i could be charged with carry ing a firearm in a dangerous manner. And of course the code has now already been posted on the having a beer. But when you carry all the time i guess you just get used to the cops messing with you. Thats life I guess.

Where did he come up with "carrying a firearm in a dangerous manner"? It sounds to me like you were dealing with a woefully misinformed LEO.
 

Marc

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 22, 2010
Messages
184
Location
St. Joseph, Missouri, USA
I wondered myself about that, I thought maybe it was possible that i misinterpreted all the legalese in the statute cuz my brother looked it up while i was being detained and he somehow thinks that i could have been charged if i had been intoxicated. It boiled down to the cops beliefs on opencarry and his beliefs about guns and alcohol.
 

MR Redenck

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2010
Messages
596
Location
West Texas
The cops took one of my guns before. I sold it too. The buddy that bought it asked why would I do such a thing. The only reason was it reminded me of getting throw in jail everytime I seen it. :cuss:
 

Citizen

Founder's Club Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2006
Messages
18,277
Location
Fairfax Co., VA
Marc,

1. I don't see in your write-up where it says you took your drinks with you when you left your property to see what was occurring. Don't reply whether you did.

2. I doubt you were charged because of the cop's beliefs on OC. Once you were carted to the station, he had to charge you with something. Otherwise, the cop was wide open to a lawsuit for false arrest.

If in fact you did not carry your drinks with you and you were not intoxicated, it could still be a false arrest. The obvious question by your lawyer for the cop: what did the cop do with the cup or beer can with your fingerprints seized as evidence that you possessed alcohol in violation of the statute?
 

MR Redenck

Regular Member
Joined
Nov 1, 2010
Messages
596
Location
West Texas
Marc,

1. I don't see in your write-up where it says you took your drinks with you when you left your property to see what was occurring. Don't reply whether you did.

2. I doubt you were charged because of the cop's beliefs on OC. Once you were carted to the station, he had to charge you with something. Otherwise, the cop was wide open to a lawsuit for false arrest.

If in fact you did not carry your drinks with you and you were not intoxicated, it could still be a false arrest. The obvious question by your lawyer for the cop: what did the cop do with the cup or beer can with your fingerprints seized as evidence that you possessed alcohol in violation of the statute?

You sound like a lawyer. If so, what are you doing with those conservitive values? :lol:
 

xc9subcompact

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2011
Messages
106
Location
Secure Undisclosed
Did they confiscate the beverage container? It will need to be tested to prove it contains alcohol. The presence of the container isn't sufficient proof for a conviction.
 

lancers

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2008
Messages
231
Location
St. Louis, Missouri, USA
Did they confiscate the beverage container? It will need to be tested to prove it contains alcohol. The presence of the container isn't sufficient proof for a conviction.

You are right about open containers. I believe with sealed containers, the law assumes they had alcohol in them as marked. It is the burden of the defendant to prove unopened containers did not have alcohol as indicated by the label.
 

cash50

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 24, 2010
Messages
349
Location
St. Louis
You are right about open containers. I believe with sealed containers, the law assumes they had alcohol in them as marked. It is the burden of the defendant to prove unopened containers did not have alcohol as indicated by the label.

That makes no sense, therefore it probably is the procedure in municipal court.
 

MKEgal

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2010
Messages
4,385
Location
in front of my computer, WI
MR Redenck said:
The cops took one of my guns before. I sold it too. The buddy that bought it asked why would I do such a thing. The only reason was it reminded me of getting thrown in jail everytime I saw it.
FTFY
I've had a pistol (same one) stolen by police twice now (2 different departments), and even though it appears to be a trouble magnet :p I have no plans to sell it.

The first time it was taken, it was returned within a couple weeks,
& I have a letter from the DA of that county saying I committed no crime & the stop of my car (let alone the search) was bad,
& I got a settlement from a 1983 suit against that city.
So it reminds me of victory.
(I did, however, clean it thoroughly once I got it back, then took it to the range, then cleaned it again.)

I anticipate the second incident will turn out much like the first. The suit was filed not quite 2 weeks ago.
 
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