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Conceal Carry on private property.

WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,910
Location
North Carolina
I was wondering if you can carry concealed on private property such as your house or personal business without a CHP?
It is legal to conceal on your own property, others private property not so much. As for myself I see no need to conceal at home.
 

j.clay507

New member
Joined
May 9, 2014
Messages
16
Location
Greensboro, NC
It is legal to conceal on your own property, others private property not so much. As for myself I see no need to conceal at home.
I am about to get my first handgun and i am on my church security team. My pastor wants me to conceal carry when i get it but i didnt know if i had to wait until i got my chp since it is private property
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
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Location
here nc
I am about to get my first handgun and i am on my church security team. My pastor wants me to conceal carry when i get it but i didnt know if i had to wait until i got my chp since it is private property
you know mate there was a very, very, almost identical similarly worded post and thread in the Colorado ...hummm!!

sure you want to toddle down this CC path on the OC forum???

oh by the way why do one of your previous posts on this sub forum specifically state on the 9th of May 2014 you have already purchased a firearm??? blah blah from a friend who is a LE???

ipse
 
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Wstar425

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2014
Messages
565
Location
Tomahawk and Abbotsford, Wi.
I conceal carry in church. We don't have a security team, but there are quite a few guys that carry on Sundays. I've asked a couple of Elders about open carry and have not gotten a real strong answer back either way. Kinda like we'd like you not to, but we don't really know what we would do if someone did come in OC. I said I thought they better think about it cause it might happen someday. Lots of guys walking around with untucked shirts, although I have chosen to wear a sport jacket instead. If you knew me, you would know I am the LAST person in the world to wear a sport jacket, although with jeans I can kinda pull it off I think.

I think a lot of your answers are state dependant, since we don't know what state you are in its kinda of like shooting in the dark. I might offer that if you are just getting your first handgun you would need lots of time and training before you thought about using it. I have had some conversations with other guys carrying about what it "might" look like in a church when a shot goes off. I suspect that it would be mass chaos with people going every which way. Someone from outside the church might not be so particular about what they were shooting at, where as a security member would not want to be so indiscriminate. I suppose it is no different than anywhere else with lots of people packed into a small area, but it sure gives you something to think about.

He said his pastor wants him to CC, I could read that as he was thinking maybe he wanted to OC instead? However, if you are asking these BASIC type of questions its "possible" you're not quite ready to be on an armed security team.
 
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j.clay507

New member
Joined
May 9, 2014
Messages
16
Location
Greensboro, NC
you know mate there was a very, very, almost identical similarly worded post and thread in the Colorado ...hummm!!

sure you want to toddle down this CC path on the OC forum???

oh by the way why do one of your previous posts on this sub forum specifically state on the 9th of May 2014 you have already purchased a firearm??? blah blah from a friend who is a LE???

ipse
I have shot handguns and i am trained with firearms. I turn 21in a week, thats why i haven't bought one yet. I plan on OC all the time and this is one of the very very few reasons i would get a CHP. And i was planning on buying one from a friend but it didn't work out
 
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WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,910
Location
North Carolina
I am about to get my first handgun and i am on my church security team. My pastor wants me to conceal carry when i get it but i didnt know if i had to wait until i got my chp since it is private property
So the church is not your private property? Then no! And you may want to check into state specific laws concerning armed security.
 

solus

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Aug 22, 2013
Messages
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here nc
I have shot handguns and i am trained with firearms. I turn 21in a week, thats why i haven't bought one yet. I plan on OC all the time and this is one of the very very few reasons i would get a CHP. And i was planning on buying one from a friend but it didn't work out
quote

Thread: Open Cary Age for handguns
by j.clay507

Replies: 4
Views: 502

Im am 20 and a new owner of a handgun and want to make sure i abide by the law. So it is ok to open carry before 21 as long as you are 18+

unquote

you were saying mate?

ipse
 

j.clay507

New member
Joined
May 9, 2014
Messages
16
Location
Greensboro, NC
quote

Thread: Open Cary Age for handguns
by j.clay507

Replies: 4
Views: 502


Im am 20 and a new owner of a handgun and want to make sure i abide by the law. So it is ok to open carry before 21 as long as you are 18+

unquote

you were saying mate?

ipse

I was going to get it later that day and it fell through
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
7,987
Location
here nc
first of all, you concealing or open carrying on church property for 'a security patrol' on the oral word of your 'pastor' might not protect you from judicial oversight.

you are putting yourself at substantial personal pecuniary risk especially since the use of deadly force is not covered under NC statutes to preclude or stop thieves, or trespass activities, or effect a citizen's arrest, or even pointing your firearm at anybody is a felon consideration.

BTW, I am again curious so what pray tell does a church security patrol need with firearms?

ipse

ps...HBday?
 
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CDT COX

Regular Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2010
Messages
277
Location
NC
first of all, you concealing or open carrying on church property for 'a security patrol' on the oral word of your 'pastor' might not protect you from judicial oversight.

you are putting yourself at substantial personal pecuniary risk especially since the use of deadly force is not covered under NC statutes to preclude or stop thieves, or trespass activities, or effect a citizen's arrest, or even pointing your firearm at anybody is a felon consideration.

BTW, I am again curious so what pray tell does a church security patrol need with firearms?

ipse

ps...HBday?
Probably one of those mega churches with thousands of dollars in instruments and audio visual equipment and the pastor drives a new BMW.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
7,987
Location
here nc
Probably one of those mega churches with thousands of dollars in instruments and audio visual equipment and the pastor drives a new BMW.
CDT, please remember,
(reviewing a borrowed DOJ tome)
1. "NC statutes does not permit the use of deadly force solely to protect property, to prevent theft, or to regain stolen property." (pg 31, NC DOJ academy's Laws covering conceal hand gun and use of deadly force)

2. "Trespassers may be in violation of the law, but the law does not allow deadly force to end the trespass." (pg 32, same cite.)

3. 15A-404(a) No Arrest; Detention Permitted. – No private person may arrest another person except as provided in G.S. 15A-405. A private person may detain another person as provided in this section. http://www.ncga.state.nc.us/EnactedLegislation/Statutes/PDF/ByArticle/Chapter_15A/Article_20.pdf

5. NC statutes 14-34 makes it clear intentionally point a handgun at another is a crime, Assault by Pointing a Gun http://www.ncleg.net/gascripts/SiteSearch/SiteSearch.asp?cx=016444635331331191208:2jn1cirfegg&cof=FORID:11&q=14-34&sa=Go


you will note with interest CDT, et al., NC statutes do not quantify OC or CC firearm use so my question remains...WHY??

ipse
 

razor_baghdad

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2008
Messages
277
Location
CONUS ~for now~
@solus Your argument "Why armed security at a church?" seems ridiculous to me. Let's go back a few years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqDVBWcBy2g

Secondly, no-one stated anything about pointing a gun at anyone or stopping trespass or anything of the like. You seem to be condescending a fellow OCer on this board with pointless statements and irrelevant cites.

The strawman argument you seem to be using here is "Why carry a gun at all if I can't use it or point it or stop any criminals from conducting criminal activity?". I find this argument ludicrous. You carry a gun for personal protection and in defense of you and your family from mortal danger.....so why chastise? Where's your teaching point?

Give the kid a break.
 

solus

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
7,987
Location
here nc
@solus Your argument "Why armed security at a church?" seems ridiculous to me. Let's go back a few years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqDVBWcBy2g
Secondly, no-one stated anything about pointing a gun at anyone or stopping trespass or anything of the like. You seem to be condescending a fellow OCer on this board with pointless statements and irrelevant cites.
The strawman argument you seem to be using here is "Why carry a gun at all if I can't use it or point it or stop any criminals from conducting criminal activity?". I find this argument ludicrous. You carry a gun for personal protection and in defense of you and your family from mortal danger.....so why chastise? Where's your teaching point?
Give the kid a break.
razor, et al., my teaching point is multiple fold:
1. the young man has no knowledge about pecuniary liability as he 'functions' on a presumed volunteer 'security team' strictly on the verbal guidance of a 'pastor'!

2. the young man by his own admission lacks a CHP, therefore he has failed to get even a rudimentary understanding of NC statutes and the use of deadly force and may be under the mistaken expectation(s) they can stop thief of property, or trespass, or possibly pull their firearms to accomplish a citizen's arrest!! the statutes were cited so they might do their own due diligence seeking appropriate information.

3. since he is not CHP trained he therefore lacks the rudimentary understanding on the four criteria necessary to meet the bare minimum of judicial defense to use deadly force of yourself, loved ones, as well as defense of others ,and as such would then would be subject to judicial oversight to defend his actions at a cost of personal $$$ as the team is working under 'verbal' guidance of a pastor let alone be covered by the church's insurance for legal expenses?

Razor, as you state, quote: You carry a gun for personal protection and in defense of you and your family from mortal danger....unquote. he does not wish to carry for this purpose razor, et al., he wishes to purposefully conceal/open carry for a completely alternative motive, one which has significant consequences that the members of this forum owe him to provide him or any reader information to possibly preclude a youthful mis-step which, like Zimmerman, could have dire consequences for the remainder of his life!

strawman argument, chastising...sorry no, providing my expertise and due diligence on the ramifications of his actions carrying a firearm as part of a security team on church property that this young man should seriously consider before stepping out on this activity.

and regarding the COS New Life Church debacle, please remember Ms Assam was at the time a professional LE who attends that church and btw would fall under the smallest judicial oversight and as the pastor says the new life church's security team is screened and trained, blah blah...this young man is not trained.

on final comment...he did not ask a question about OC'g but rather can he CC on private property therefore he is not a OC'r!! as he doesn't even have a gun according to his own postings!!

therefore, my question still remains unanswered: WHY?

btw, thanks for allowing me to quantify my rationale...

ipse
 
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Maverick9

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2013
Messages
1,405
Location
Mid-atlantic
first of all, you concealing or open carrying on church property for 'a security patrol' on the oral word of your 'pastor' might not protect you from judicial oversight.

you are putting yourself at substantial personal pecuniary risk especially since the use of deadly force is not covered under NC statutes to preclude or stop thieves, or trespass activities, or effect a citizen's arrest, or even pointing your firearm at anybody is a felon consideration.

BTW, I am again curious so what pray tell does a church security patrol need with firearms?

ipse

ps...HBday?
Was just going to say that it's probably a very, very foolish idea to carry a firearm and be 'appointed' (allegedly) by the pastor (for what?), because when push comes to shove the pastor is just as likely to say 'I don't know anything about a 'church security team'.

My advice? Keep it in your pants and only use if personally in grave danger of life and limb.

Otherwise get it in writing from the church board, get an umbrella insurance policy and before that, just lock the doors of the church during and after collection.
 
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