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Louisiana open carry question

SlaughterOC

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I open carry, do not have a CCW, by definition, do I have to take my firearm off my belt when I get into my vehicle? The "law" is a little confusing to me on this matter.

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Grapeshot

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Based on the controversy that Wisconsin had, he may be asking is his gun concealed by being in a vehicle? What defines concealment in LA?
Here's a quick primer on carrying guns in vehicles in Louisiana: You may have a gun. You may carry it in your vehicle. You may have it concealed, in the open, on the dash, on the seat, under the seat, in the glove box or hanging from the rear-view mirror.

Possession of a gun in your vehicle is perfectly legal in Louisiana as the vehicle is considered an extension of your home (As it is worded in LRS 14:95.2: "Any constitutionally protected activity which cannot be regulated by the state, such as a firearm contained entirely within a motor vehicle.")

http://www.louisianasportsman.com/details.php?id=1226
 

HeroHog

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Here's a quick primer on carrying guns in vehicles in Louisiana: You may have a gun. You may carry it in your vehicle. You may have it concealed, in the open, on the dash, on the seat, under the seat, in the glove box or hanging from the rear-view mirror.

Possession of a gun in your vehicle is perfectly legal in Louisiana as the vehicle is considered an extension of your home (As it is worded in LRS 14:95.2: "Any constitutionally protected activity which cannot be regulated by the state, such as a firearm contained entirely within a motor vehicle.")

http://www.louisianasportsman.com/details.php?id=1226
That doesn't mean concealed ON YOUR PERSON. It means concealed in your car's glove box, console, under the seat or whatever unless you have a Concealed Carry permit recognized in Louisiana. Carrying openly on your person is perfectly fine, even in your car and even if it is not easily seen by the officer because of the arm rest or whatever. If when you are standing out of the car the gun can be easily seen and identified as a gun, you're good.
NOTE: In Louisiana, if you have a CHP and are carrying CONCEALED (some cops and prosecutors would argue carrying at all), you MUST inform any cop who stops you!
 
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HeroHog

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Side note: Some argue that you could carry concealed in your car/home due to the wording of the law but winning that one in court would be a VERY tough and expensive battle that I would bet against. It's your call...

My public conversation with gun friendly New Orleans lawyer Owen Courreges
http://law.justia.com/codes/louisiana/2011/rs/title14/rs14-95-2-1/
LA Rev Stat § 14:95.2.1 §95.2.1. "Illegal carrying of a firearm at a parade with any firearm used in the commission of a crime of violence"

Speedy: My personal issue: as a layperson, I would think a good lawyer would have a field day with seeing as open carry is NOT "illegal carry" and concealed carry with a permit is also legal and also that you are do not posses "any firearm used in the commission of a crime of violence," one should be able to fight this.

Owen Courreges: It's a minor exception. The offense already requires that the person also use the gun during a crime of violence, and how many would-be criminals would open carry to a parade to commit a crime of violence? They'd be seen and stopped very quickly. With respect to concealed carry, there's a separate law saying you can't carry concealed at a parade even with a CHL, I believe.

Speedy: Now, you could also open carry at a parade without committing a crime of violence... The law doesn't seem to cover that, at least not here... But it's just not a great idea and thus I've never heard of anybody doing it (retention issues, difficulty of using a firearm defensively in crowds, you'll probably want to drink because parades are boring without alcohol, etc.).

Owen Courreges: Yeah, it's La. R.S. 40:1379.3(N)(9) that says CHL holders can't legally carry at a parade.

Speedy: I realize I'm picking nits but law/lawyers, that's what ya do, right? "N. No concealed handgun may be carried into and no concealed handgun permit issued
pursuant to this Section shall authorize or entitle a permittee to carry a concealed handgun *IN* any of the following: (9) A parade or demonstration for which a permit is issued by a governmental entity."

What constitutes being *IN* a parade Owen?

Owen Courreges: Hmmm... You have something there. The most natural reading of being "in" a parade is actually participating, not merely attending. That said, I suspect a judge would throw the rule of lenity out the window if the issue actually came in front of them and find the accused guilty.

Just look at how the courts have handled the new gun rights amendment. I think it pretty clearly guaranteed constitutional carry by omitting language that allowed restrictions on concealment and also adding language subjecting all gun restrictions to strict scrutiny, but thus far the courts have basically ignored those facts and argued that everyone simply intended to preserve all existing gun laws (a preposterous notion not supported by the text). Judges don't like radical outcomes.

So while you're correct legally, I doubt it would pan out that way in practice. Basically, the one major decision on the issue decided that the people of Louisiana basically superimposed "new" before "restriction," so that all traditional restrictions were basically grandfathered in. They essentially just amended the text arbitrarily. It's a very frustrating decision.
 
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SlaughterOC

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That was my question. On my person, without a CCW even in my vehicle is a NO. I just have to take out and place it in the center console until I get out of the vehicle and resume to OC. Thank you for the info.

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HeroHog

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That was my question. On my person, without a CCW even in my vehicle is a NO. I just have to take out and place it in the center console until I get out of the vehicle and resume to OC. Thank you for the info.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk
If it is NOT covered by your clothing, it IS legal in a car. In a holster, IWB, right side, shirt tucked BEHIND the gun, grip NORMALLY visible, no jacket covering the gun, but the gun is covered by the seatbelt: Still perfectly legal in Louisiana.
 

Grapeshot

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I defer to the gentleman (Speedy/HeroHog) who is intimately more familiar with the nuances of the law there than am I.
 

HeroHog

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My $0.02 on something: If there is ANY chance that during the stop the officer will see my gun, even if I do NOT have duty to inform, I WILL let them know I have a loaded gun and where it is and ask what they want me to do. I will do that with my hands on the steering wheel, making no sudden movements and choose my words very carefully, I suggest; "Officer, I have my pistol in the car with me and I didn't want you to see it and be startled. It is (wherever) and it is loaded. How would you like me to proceed?" I have had them tell me just not to touch it when I had to get papers right out from under it. No problems. Cops are used to guns in cars/trucks here. I recommend having your wallet on the dash before they get to your car and your insurance and registration papers out or available and in sight and your hands on the wheel when the cop gets to your door. If it's at night, have your dome light on. This way you don't have to reach where the cop can't see your hands and it keeps them from getting jumpy.

I do NOT recommend giving them permission to search you or your car. If they have Reasonable Actionable Suspicion (RAS) or a warrant, they won't need your permission, otherwise, hell no!
 
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BB62

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...I do NOT recommend giving them permission to search you or your car. If they have Reasonable Actionable Suspicion (RAS) or a warrant, they won't need your permission, otherwise, hell no!
I've never heard RAS referred to as "Reasonable Actionable Suspicion". The phrase I'm aware of is "Reasonable Articulable Suspicion".
 

HeroHog

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I've never heard RAS referred to as "Reasonable Actionable Suspicion". The phrase I'm aware of is "Reasonable Articulable Suspicion".
I've seen it go both ways but "Articulable" is probably the most correct. I gave it a quick Google last night and "Actionable" came up as what I was looking for (because I was struggling to remember which was right) so I went with it. (shrugs) :p

Google "Reasonable Actionable Suspicion" and see what ya get.
 
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georg jetson

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I open carry, do not have a CCW, by definition, do I have to take my firearm off my belt when I get into my vehicle? The "law" is a little confusing to me on this matter.

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A firearm in a holster on a belt is not concealed regardless of your presence inside or outside a car/truck. The simple answer to your simple question is "no, you don't have to take your firearm off your belt".
 
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georg jetson

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That doesn't mean concealed ON YOUR PERSON. It means concealed in your car's glove box, console, under the seat or whatever unless you have a Concealed Carry permit recognized in Louisiana. Carrying openly on your person is perfectly fine, even in your car and even if it is not easily seen by the officer because of the arm rest or whatever. If when you are standing out of the car the gun can be easily seen and identified as a gun, you're good.
NOTE: In Louisiana, if you have a CHP and are carrying, you MUST inform any cop who stops you!
Just to clarify... In La, if you have a CHP and are carrying CONCEALED, you must inform...
 

HeroHog

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Just to clarify... In La, if you have a CHP and are carrying CONCEALED, you must inform...
Right, although some cops and prosecutors might see that differently.

The CHP rules state:

...when any peace officer approaches a permittee in an official manner or with an identified purpose, the permittee shall:
Notify the officer that he has a weapon on his person;
Submit to a pat down;
Allow the officer to temporarily disarm him.


Note that this doesn't stipulate that the gun be concealed BUT this IS a concealed carry law. Good luck with this one...
 
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MAC702

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...The CHP rules state:

...when any peace officer approaches a permittee in an official manner or with an identified purpose, the permittee shall:
Notify the officer that he has a weapon on his person;...


Just another freedom you voluntarily forfeit when you choose to become a permittee, apparently.
 

georg jetson

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Right, although some cops and prosecutors might see that differently.

The CHP rules state:

...when any peace officer approaches a permittee in an official manner or with an identified purpose, the permittee shall:
Notify the officer that he has a weapon on his person;
Submit to a pat down;
Allow the officer to temporarily disarm him.


Note that this doesn't stipulate that the gun be concealed BUT this IS a concealed carry law. Good luck with this one...
No need t notify if openly carrying, correct? Firearm is obvious.

In a car a permittee shall only notify if firearm is concealed on his person.
 

HeroHog

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No need t notify if openly carrying, correct? Firearm is obvious.

In a car a permittee shall only notify if firearm is concealed on his person.
I agree, my points is some cops are ignorant, some are bass-holes and some prosecutors want to make names for themselves and I just want people to be aware of the possibilities that they may have to deal with.
 

MAC702

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No need to notify if openly carrying, correct? Firearm is obvious.....
An openly carried firearm is not obvious if worn at 4+ o'clock in a car seat and under a seat belt, perhaps not even to officer on the passenger side window. It is quite easy to miss, especially, if not a contrasting color. Yet, to my knowledge, this is still OC and no permit required. But if you do have a permit...
 
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