Might be my new OC piece

[BlaineG]

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Hammer wrote:

sv_libertarian wrote:

Hammer wrote:

And if we're worried about BP, whose handle says 45/70?

Mmmm.... When I think .45/70 I think a Ruger No. 1 or a Marlin 1895 loaded up with modern smokeless loads.

Are you familiar with the cartridge? the 45 is the caliber.
Read up on what the 70 represents.

WAY over 100 years ago, the 45-70 was the choice of the Military. You are correct in that it used 70 grains of BP. That was then and in old Springfield Trapdoor shooters. The MV was about 12-1300FPS and it helped wipe out the buffalo. Today's 45-70 is more like a .458 Magnum or .458 Lott. I choose to load mine down a bit: 405 grain cast or jacketed over 43 grains of H4198 powder for appox 1700fps out of a 26" bbl. A popular load is also a 300 grain Nosler over about + 50 grains of H4198 or H322 or R7 or perhaps IMR 3031 for 2,300+ fps. PLEASE don't talk poop that you know absolutely nothing about, Sir......You're looking foolish to those who know what they are talking about. BTW, those are published loads and safe in modern Marlin or Winchester rifles. In a Ruger #1, which Bear has and I've shot, you can do much, much better. Bet you won't want to shoot 10 hot 45-70s in a row after the first one:what:If you're going to load that ROA hot, be sure to use plenty of grease on top of the bullet.....You don't want to chain fire that SOB:uhoh:

 

[Wheelgunner]

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As usual, I am a little late to the discussion.

Hammer, you have got to be kidding.

As a pistol expert (past Pistolsmith, avid shooter and holder of a copyrighted product in weapons technology), there is so much wrong with what you are doing that I don't know where to start, so I'll just do a short list.

1. YOU BACKBORED YOUR PISTOL!

This is called the "short road to suicide". Boring out your pistol to hold more powder (even as I write it, I still can't believe it) is an unbelievably stupid thing to do. Even the engineers who designed the cylinder and added a safety factor would vomit at the thought of you "Backboring" your cylinder. Was it "backbored" straight? Did a crack form when the "backboring" was done? Plus, are you weakening the cylinder to shoot reduced loads? NO! You are weakening the cylinder to shoot the biggest, meanest, toughest loads you can possibly stuff into the cylinder, probably 110% of Max Spec. The frame size is irrelevant if the cylinder lets go, but hey, Good idea! By the way, your warranty is void, so if you friends start calling you stumpy or you suddenly need to purchase a guide dog, don't expect Bill Ruger to cut you a check for accidental injury.

2. CAPPED CARRY!

Ruger specifies that the old army not be carried with a capped, loaded cylinder. This is because old style caps are exposed verses a modern revolver which encloses the cap in brass and steel, out of the way of chance encounters with cell phones, belt buckles, jean jacket buttons, etc., leading to an accidental discharge down your leg or through your balls.

3. Reliability

Black powder weapons are notorious for jamming up when you need them most. Caps work loose, crap gets in them, caps shatter and jam the mechanism during firing, an endless list of problems. The last great pistol fighter who wore them was "Wild Bill" Hickok, who wore TWO, and just before a fight he cleaned them with tiny tools to make sure they would work ONCE.

4. Where is HE?

The blast of the black power is going to blind you to your target. While you opponent only needs to shoot into the smoke, you will be searching for him in a fog. GOOD LUCK!

5. I hit you and you and you......

The comment Bear makes about overpenetration is right on point. I carry a double action revolver and shoot a load with more power than yours, but I use a bullet that will stop in my opponent and not ricochet like a golf ball through two or three bystanders. The days of solid lead, nonexpanding rounds in pistols went out in the 1960's. Please remember that you are legally responsible for every round you fire. A solid lead ball or conical bullet is the very definition of overpenatration, bringing back memories of the infamous .38 Special "Widowmaker" round nose lead slug. Even at 800 fps the 38 would overpenetrate, not STOP or transfer energy, getting cops killed in the process. Increasing the speed merely compounds the problem, it just zips through and has more energy when it hits that baby stroller you did not mean to hit. Even in the days of solid lead slugs, the experts recommended Semi-wadcutter bullets to lessen overpenetration.

These comments are only the highlights.

 

[Citizen]

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Wheelgunner wrote:

SNIP so I'll just do a short list.

These comments are only the highlights.

Great post, Wheelgunner. Every point is familiar to me or makes good sense.

Thanks for taking the time.

 

[Hammer]

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Speaking of smoke, what have you been smoking?
Want to share it? [sarcasm off]
I'd start with a less sarcastic style, except that you seem to have lit in on me, without having read the thread- or certainly not paid much attention to my posts.

Point 1. My question is, where did you read that I backbored my pistol? In the post that started the thread, I said a friend backbored his. Later I mentioned that mine would hold 44gr of FFg, not 53.

Point 2. Ruger does NOT specify that the pistol not be carried with capped loaded cylinders. They specify that if you carry loaded, that you load and cap 5 and leave the empty under the hammer. I have the manual, and anyone who'd like one can d/l it from Ruger. They don't even have to own the gun. So, yer out in left field here.

Point 3. Did you read where this would be my sole carry piece? I rarely carry only one gun, and if I carried the Ruger, it would be for distraction, not first draw. I've read the history books, too. And, since you didn't notice the first time I wrote it, even a casual note by me left with the idea that the Ruger might be best left to carry on the way to the range on a Saturday.

Point 4. If it's not the prime carry piece, point 4 is pretty worthless.

Point 5. All very interesting theory. On the one hand, there's broad agreement by others that the Ruger won't attain the velocities necessary for .41 Mag power. Then, from some of the same lips (keyboards?) comes the overpenetration argument. Where is the consistency in that?
Next, I pointed out that I would not choose max loads as defensive loads. But all that falls on deaf ears if there's a chance to play pile on.


Finally, Boor, you are a riot!
I've been showing your post to everyone I know! We don't have clear concensus, but somewhere between 2nd and 4th grade, most learn the difference between loose and lose.
I don't think I have anything to fear from someone who can't correctly spell lose.


Wheelgunner wrote:

As usual, I am a little late to the discussion.

Hammer, you have got to be kidding.

As a pistol expert (past Pistolsmith, avid shooter and holder of a copyrighted product in weapons technology), there is so much wrong with what you are doing that I don't know where to start, so I'll just do a short list.

1. YOU BACKBORED YOUR PISTOL!



2. CAPPED CARRY!



3. Reliability



4. Where is HE?


5. I hit you and you and you......



These comments are only the highlights.


I'd call 'em the lowlights....
Hammer

Boor and Blaineless,
So, in reference to your comments below, you have nothing to say about the content of the thread, nor to retract the falsehoods you propagated, only name calling and sh!t to stir.
Since I know from experience you need to have the last word, my comments here are edited in above yours, you you can retain the "last word" 7:30 AM, 9/20

Wheelgunner,
Apparently, I ignored your need to have the last word as well. Little did you speak to your failure to read my posts, nor speak to the facts.
But you can have the last word.
Help yerself. 5:30PM, 10-1

 

[Bear 45/70]

imported post

Hammer wrote:

Finally, Boor, you are a riot!
I've been showing your post to everyone I know! We don't have clear concensus, but somewhere between 2nd and 4th grade, most learn the difference between loose and lose.
I don't think I have anything to fear from someone who can't correctly spell lose.

You obviously hang around with the rest of the morons at the sh allow end of the gene pool. Otherwise at least one of those friend(?) would know better. Then again maybe they already learned that if you argue with an idiot named Hammer. That he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

 

[BlaineG]

imported post

Bear 45/70 wrote:

Hammer wrote:

Finally, Boor, you are a riot!
I've been showing your post to everyone I know! We don't have clear concensus, but somewhere between 2nd and 4th grade, most learn the difference between loose and lose.
I don't think I have anything to fear from someone who can't correctly spell lose.

You obviously hang around with the rest of the morons at the sh allow end of the gene pool. Otherwise at least one of those friend(?) would know better. Then again maybe they already learned that if you argue with an idiot named Hammer. That he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

Someone should tell Hammer that the first rule of "Holes" is to stop digging....

 

[Bear 45/70]

imported post

BlaineG wrote:

Bear 45/70 wrote:

Hammer wrote:

Finally, Boor, you are a riot!
I've been showing your post to everyone I know! We don't have clear concensus, but somewhere between 2nd and 4th grade, most learn the difference between loose and lose.
I don't think I have anything to fear from someone who can't correctly spell lose.

You obviously hang around with the rest of the morons at the sh allow end of the gene pool. Otherwise at least one of those friend(?) would know better. Then again maybe they already learned that if you argue with an idiot named Hammer. That he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

Someone should tell Hammer that the first rule of "Holes" is to stop digging....

You mean like this........

 

[Wheelgunner]

imported post

Hammer,

You are going to carry a exposed cap, 5 shot, unreliable, under powered (compared to smokeless ammunition), smoke generating, over penetrating, black powder pistol that may blow your balls off and weighs nearly 3 pounds not for defense but for...wait for it.... "Distraction"!

HAHAHAHAHAHHA!

As to the technical aspects of the over penetration of solid lead slugs, it is not " an interesting theory" but fact. For further insight, I would suggest you read any of the excellent books on combat ammo. "Street Stoppers" by Sanow is superb and gets into a fairly technical discussion of testing procedure, energy transfer, bullet failure, the ricochet problem, wound ballistics, velocity limitations, bullet construction, jacket construction, fluid dynamics and several other aspects of modern bullet engineering. The amount of thought and effort that has gone into solving the problem of over penetration found in solid lead slugs is truly amazing.