Providing ID when open carrying

[Primus]

I see terms like "wonder" and "suspect"... I don't see calls for violence.

I also see great value in this line of reasoning because it is based not only in historical fact... But in the historical record of own Nations birth.

Colonists lived in peace with the British authorities for generations until one day EVERYTHING changed. Of course the revolution was not touched off by single days events but a culmination of a long train of abuses that reached a flash point at Concord bridge over an attempt to secure Colonial Arms.

I can certainly understand this conversation being uncomfortable for an LEO and I would expect it to illicit a response, but your uneasiness is no reason to sensor the discussion.

The reality is that our ancestors carved liberty out of oppression and did it at gun point. To think it could not or will not happen again is, IMHO, naive. The homes and families of participants on both sides were targeted by opposing forces then, and certainly would be again.

No one wishes to see American on American violence and what shocks me is the "you can't say that" response whenever this possibility is raised.

Personally, I find nothing extreme or upsetting about the true intent of 2A.

...and I believe that if we truly hope to avoid this type of violence, we should have the candor to discuss it.

Tack

Your leaving our the term... "I say we know where they live and their famines and there WILL BE CONSEQUENCES". You even cited that. If that isnt a threat I don't know what is.

You cross many lines when you bring my family into it. (Not necessarily YOU). The 2a isn't designed to come to my house and attack my family, or excise me... "consequences" towards my family.

My kid isn't the .gov. neither is my wife. Leave them out of it. Period.

And for the records the words "suspect and wonder" were used IN AGREEMENT AND AFTER the previous post which was a crystal clear blatant threat.

Edit: its not candor or even remotely productive to bring threats of harm against my family into ANY discussion. I can promise you that will bring no "compromise" or furthering of goals.

And again.... the 2a isn't so you have guns to harm my family. Its so you have guns to shoot ME when I'm acting as a government agent. To say my family is fair game under this premise makes you (general you) sound like a d bag.



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[DaveT319]

Again how do you know they encrypted the traffic? Do you have a scanner, or did someone just tell you they did? Most departments are on a repeater, with some systems you need both frequencies.

You're right, I'm taking someone else's word for it. Silly of me, right? I should really find out for myself. While I'm at it, I should never take ANYONE'S word for it and find out for myself. I wonder where I'm going to get the money to fly to North Korea and find out if they really ARE trying to make a nuclear weapon? Or to go to Afghanistan to see if there really ARE terrorists there. Or do my own research on global climate change.

Yeah, why should I believe someone else, right?

 

[Fuller Malarkey]

Snipped. I mean, I had to......


There was ONE person who stood up and called this out. DRAKEZ07. I have respect for him for at least standing up and calling the people who said this out. The rest I would say are hypocrites.

Instead guys like this are rewarded and seen as the "cadre" or cool kids. I wonder how may points for these infractions you get? I'm guessing none as long as your a card carrying member...

Actually Skippy, I don't see where DrakeZ07 even acknowledged my meager contribution to that thread......maybe things will look clearer when that cheap booze wears off and you can touch things up so it doesn't look like you had a full blown alcoholic head explosion right here in front of everyone.:lol:

Now please don't drive or shoot anything. Or beat your wife. Cops and booze are a bad mix.

 

[Primus]

Actually Skippy, I don't see where DrakeZ07 even acknowledged my meager contribution to that thread......maybe things will look clearer when that cheap booze wears off and you can touch things up so it doesn't look like you had a full blown alcoholic head explosion right here in front of everyone.:lol:

Now please don't drive or shoot anything. Or beat your wife. Cops and booze are a bad mix.

Actually quite sober thanks. Appreciate you caring so much for me.

Good to see you throw your boy under the bus though..... "oh it wasn't me occifer.. I promise... it was the OTHER guy... I just said I wonder...".

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[Fuller Malarkey]

Actually quite sober thanks. Appreciate you caring so much for me.

Good to see you throw your boy under the bus though..... "oh it wasn't me occifer.. I promise... it was the OTHER guy... I just said I wonder...".

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What, you'd like to see me confess to something I didn't do, that I was falsely accused of? How noble.

And as far as throwing "my boy under the bus", you are the only "boy" I reference, and in that context, picture me as Bubba in an orange jump suit with a cell bitch called "boy".

I suspect you were referencing another poster in that thread, HPmatt, as being "thrown under the bus" by me. And nothing could be further from the truth. I support and respect his ability to think outside the box. He has put into words some of the options available to us in the form of unconventional warfare if it comes to us resisting tyranny at the hands of government agents. Not his or my fault if that is a "loophole" you are unable to deal with and accept as very real possibility. What you HAVE done is confirm to him and us, the one's that would resist, is what a raw nerve he hit on.....

That won't be lost on those looking for way into the head of an occupying force. :lol:

Here's a civics lesson, "boy". The most effective forces this country has ever had on the ground engaged in guerrilla warfare, the most deadly and impossible to stop have been the partisan rangers. You kill one and six more pop up. I know for a fact it won't take much for the reassembly of the 43rd Battalion, Virginia Cavalry. Most government thugs smart enough to tie their shoes around there know it too.

 

[Fallschirjmäger]

Almost any departments communications are available over the internet, UNSCRAMBLED. There are also apps on smart phones to listen to police calls over the internet. BTW how would you know they are encrypted, because they say so?

Doesn't need to be "encrypted", an agency merely has to upgrade to digital radio.

 

[WalkingWolf]

Doesn't need to be "encrypted", an agency merely has to upgrade to digital radio.

Scanning by apps is not off of scanners, it is a direct feed. Anything a dispatcher or officer can hear the public can hear. It just depends on if the dept subscribes, they may get kickbacks for offering the services to the public. The apps are usually free, paid for by advertisers and the adds that pop up on the app.

Besides I am not going to on the side of the road try to determine whether my info is going out to anybody who wishes it. I just decline to be a victim, of the state or criminals. YMMV

 

[Tackleberry1]

Again Primus...

I think you are inferring a threat from a "hypothetical" and coming off a with a self important tone. The only Americans who think Cops are special... are Cops.

Personally, I have no animosity toward you or your profession but in my book, your safety is no more important than mine and your family is no more important than mine.

IMHO... If you've ever participated in a no knock warrant, you've shown blatant disregard for the safety of others making you, the LEO, the only one here actually guilty of putting someone else's loved ones in harms way.

The entire point of this conversation is not threaten anyone, but to help Cops understand that they, and only they, hold the keys to peace or violence in the context of Government oppression.

If government agents choose to violently break their oaths and engage citizens, it's reasonable to assume that citizens will respond in the same way they did in 1776... and it is prudent for all involved to understand the tactics of that time because they would certainly be used again.

The "relative" safety afforded to LEO's is not a function of the badge, the vest, the gun, or the backup... It is safety bestowed upon you by the consent of the governed. Should the governed revoke that consent, safety and peace along with it will evaporate.

The relative peace enjoyed by most American communities is not a product of effective policing, it is a product of consent and the greatest risk to that consent is the militarization of our LEO's.

Tack

Your leaving our the term... "I say we know where they live and their famines and there WILL BE CONSEQUENCES". You even cited that. If that isnt a threat I don't know what is.

You cross many lines when you bring my family into it. (Not necessarily YOU). The 2a isn't designed to come to my house and attack my family, or excise me... "consequences" towards my family.

My kid isn't the .gov. neither is my wife. Leave them out of it. Period.

And for the records the words "suspect and wonder" were used IN AGREEMENT AND AFTER the previous post which was a crystal clear blatant threat.

Edit: its not candor or even remotely productive to bring threats of harm against my family into ANY discussion. I can promise you that will bring no "compromise" or furthering of goals.

And again.... the 2a isn't so you have guns to harm my family. Its so you have guns to shoot ME when I'm acting as a government agent. To say my family is fair game under this premise makes you (general you) sound like a d bag.



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[Fallschirjmäger]

Scanning by apps is not off of scanners, it is a direct feed. Anything a dispatcher or officer can hear the public can hear. It just depends on if the dept subscribes, they may get kickbacks for offering the services to the public. The apps are usually free, paid for by advertisers and the adds that pop up on the app.

Besides I am not going to on the side of the road try to determine whether my info is going out to anybody who wishes it. I just decline to be a victim, of the state or criminals. YMMV

So, where does this "feed" originate from? Is there a microphone connected to an analog broadcasting system sitting beside the dispatcher as he speaks into the microphone connected to the digital radio system?

 

[Primus]

Again Primus...

I think you are inferring a threat from a "hypothetical" and coming off a with a self important tone. The only Americans who think Cops are special... are Cops.

Personally, I have no animosity toward you or your profession but in my book, your safety is no more important than mine and your family is no more important than mine.

IMHO... If you've ever participated in a no knock warrant, you've shown blatant disregard for the safety of others making you, the LEO, the only one here actually guilty of putting someone else's loved ones in harms way.

The entire point of this conversation is not threaten anyone, but to help Cops understand that they, and only they, hold the keys to peace or violence in the context of Government oppression.

If government agents choose to violently break their oaths and engage citizens, it's reasonable to assume that citizens will respond in the same way they did in 1776... and it is prudent for all involved to understand the tactics of that time because they would certainly be used again.

The "relative" safety afforded to LEO's is not a function of the badge, the vest, the gun, or the backup... It is safety bestowed upon you by the consent of the governed. Should the governed revoke that consent, safety and peace along with it will evaporate.

The relative peace enjoyed by most American communities is not a product of effective policing, it is a product of consent and the greatest risk to that consent is the militarization of our LEO's.

Tack

1) this isn't about cops. He said "soldiers,police, TSA types". Actually gave a list. Its actually more towards guys in the military seeing as how this thread is about the Ohio national guard training. So the police thing is irrelevant. I also happen to be in the national guard so this hits home in that front too. That addresses most of your argument. I wasn't making this just about leos, they were only one on the hit list.


2) Can you ease cite in 1776 or any other time guys were attacking soldiers families in the US? Specifically their families as was suggested.

Finally, to clear it up... are you also saying its ok to target guys families at their homes as was suggested? Again.. this goes for military, police, TSA, etc.

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[Primus]

1) this isn't about cops. He said "soldiers,police, TSA types". Actually gave a list. Its actually more towards guys in the military seeing as how it was in the thread is about the Ohio national guard training. So the police thing is irrelevant. I also happen to be in the national guard so this hits home in that front too. That addresses most of your argument. I wasn't making this just about leos, they were only one on the hit list.


2) Can you ease cite in 1776 or any other time guys were attacking soldiers families in the US? Specifically their families as was suggested.

Finally, to clear it up... are you also saying its ok to target guys families at their homes as was suggested? Again.. this goes for military, police, TSA, etc.

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[Grapeshot]

OP is about providing ID to LEOs

The OP did not reference the National Guard.

Further this thread has gone far off on a tangent, beyond migrating to parallels, and that much animosity is perceived.

We do not threaten people nor their family with harm here. We do not "Do unto others, before they do unto us." or in response to a perceived ill.

Too far off course, beyond redemption - locked it.