imported post
Hi gang;
Unfortunately something I did not think likely in NM happened two days ago and I would appreciate some feedback on what you guys might feel is the next course of action (if any) that would be appropriate.
This past Monday I was finishing my lunch and on my cell phone with my friend's widow discussing matters pertaining to the disposition of his estate when two deputies walked into the restaurant and past my booth. I assumed they sat down for lunch. About two minutes later one of them walked up to my booth and demanded my attention. I asked my friend's widow to please hang on and then spoke to the deputy and remarked that if this was about my gun, I was carrying legally and if he wanted to I would be happy to speak with him about it after I completed my business call. He insisted that I immediately give him my drivers license AND my carry permit. I reminded him that this was no such permit in the state of New Mexico and asked my friend's widow to please allow me to call her back after I attended to the sheriff's deputy. When I hung up the deputy said he did not want me to inform him about the laws in this state and he again demanded my permit and license and that if I refused to comply he would be happy to continue this matter outside. I took this to be meant as a threat of some sort.
I then reached into my pocket, got out my wallet, opened it and first retrieved the driver's license which I, in the manner of revealing a poker hand flipped over onto the tabletop immediately in front of me. I also again reminded the deputy that there was no such thing as a permit to carry a gun in the open, as this was covered by the state constitution directly. The deputy then accused me of throwing my license at him. (!! He was standing off to my right of my booth and the license was in front of me on the table.) He also wanted me to "hand him" the license. He again asked for the permit. I told him a have several concealed carry permits, and then retrieved my NM one, scooped up the drivers license and then handed both to him as requested. I also reminded him that I had NOT, in fact, thrown anything at him at any time, and that I complied with his demands. He then again repeated that we could handle this outside if I so choose to.
He looked at my license and permits for a very brief moment, and then placed them on the table. I then asked for his card. He refused to give one to me, but then told me his name and his "man number". He then (without my asking) gave me a phone number he said was for "internal affairs" and told me he would be o.k. if I called them. He then said that he was just verifying that things were o.k., that my having a concealed carry permit allowed me to carry my gun in the fashion I was carrying it (open), and that he "...did not care about anything else because when he is on duty he will make sure people are safe." (!!)
I IMMEDIATELY called the number he gave me which was not a direct line to internal affairs but merely an incoming number to "communications". Sadly it then took me 35 minutes and 8 phone calls, the last to the sheriff's admin. offices to get through to internal affairs. The Lt. that finally answered apologized for the delay and we discussed the matter. She was very insistant about wanting me to file a formal report, but I wanted to be assured that both training and discipline would be immediate and it seemed like the formal procedure would not yield as affirmative a result as an informal report. The Lt. was also clear that her understanding of the laws in NM concerning open carry of firearms where the same as mine. She did NOT however want to talk about what the department's official policy towards open carry might be !!
I spoke with here again about an hour later as was informed that the officer would be disciplined later that day.
The next day (yesterday) I asked and was told that the deputy still had not been disciplined and that it was hoped I would understand that the department would not be sharing ANY information with me on the outcome, and that I would not be getting any apology or feedback. I was also reminded that like many situations in NM, there are not enough smart people around and some stupid people get hired.
Today I was called by a Sergeant LaBatta (sp ?) of Internal Affairs. He was calling me about the "weapons carry" in the restaurant, apparently returning my call-in from Monday during the period when I wasn't able to get a hold of anybody within his department. He was more open to trying to relay my wish to talk with the deputy's supervisor, and he offered that an informal report was the best way to get an immediate disciplinary response. I also asked for the forms to open an official complaint, should I not hear back from the deputies' supervisor.
At his point I am not sure that my decision to file an informal report was correct or that it will yield any improvements in this deputy's behavior and attitude. I am also more than a little concerned that the department has not, to date, wanted to share their procedure concerning how and why and when they consider it appropriate to approach an open-carry citizen without a reasonable suspicion of criminal behavior.
Hi gang;
Unfortunately something I did not think likely in NM happened two days ago and I would appreciate some feedback on what you guys might feel is the next course of action (if any) that would be appropriate.
This past Monday I was finishing my lunch and on my cell phone with my friend's widow discussing matters pertaining to the disposition of his estate when two deputies walked into the restaurant and past my booth. I assumed they sat down for lunch. About two minutes later one of them walked up to my booth and demanded my attention. I asked my friend's widow to please hang on and then spoke to the deputy and remarked that if this was about my gun, I was carrying legally and if he wanted to I would be happy to speak with him about it after I completed my business call. He insisted that I immediately give him my drivers license AND my carry permit. I reminded him that this was no such permit in the state of New Mexico and asked my friend's widow to please allow me to call her back after I attended to the sheriff's deputy. When I hung up the deputy said he did not want me to inform him about the laws in this state and he again demanded my permit and license and that if I refused to comply he would be happy to continue this matter outside. I took this to be meant as a threat of some sort.
I then reached into my pocket, got out my wallet, opened it and first retrieved the driver's license which I, in the manner of revealing a poker hand flipped over onto the tabletop immediately in front of me. I also again reminded the deputy that there was no such thing as a permit to carry a gun in the open, as this was covered by the state constitution directly. The deputy then accused me of throwing my license at him. (!! He was standing off to my right of my booth and the license was in front of me on the table.) He also wanted me to "hand him" the license. He again asked for the permit. I told him a have several concealed carry permits, and then retrieved my NM one, scooped up the drivers license and then handed both to him as requested. I also reminded him that I had NOT, in fact, thrown anything at him at any time, and that I complied with his demands. He then again repeated that we could handle this outside if I so choose to.
He looked at my license and permits for a very brief moment, and then placed them on the table. I then asked for his card. He refused to give one to me, but then told me his name and his "man number". He then (without my asking) gave me a phone number he said was for "internal affairs" and told me he would be o.k. if I called them. He then said that he was just verifying that things were o.k., that my having a concealed carry permit allowed me to carry my gun in the fashion I was carrying it (open), and that he "...did not care about anything else because when he is on duty he will make sure people are safe." (!!)
I IMMEDIATELY called the number he gave me which was not a direct line to internal affairs but merely an incoming number to "communications". Sadly it then took me 35 minutes and 8 phone calls, the last to the sheriff's admin. offices to get through to internal affairs. The Lt. that finally answered apologized for the delay and we discussed the matter. She was very insistant about wanting me to file a formal report, but I wanted to be assured that both training and discipline would be immediate and it seemed like the formal procedure would not yield as affirmative a result as an informal report. The Lt. was also clear that her understanding of the laws in NM concerning open carry of firearms where the same as mine. She did NOT however want to talk about what the department's official policy towards open carry might be !!
I spoke with here again about an hour later as was informed that the officer would be disciplined later that day.
The next day (yesterday) I asked and was told that the deputy still had not been disciplined and that it was hoped I would understand that the department would not be sharing ANY information with me on the outcome, and that I would not be getting any apology or feedback. I was also reminded that like many situations in NM, there are not enough smart people around and some stupid people get hired.
Today I was called by a Sergeant LaBatta (sp ?) of Internal Affairs. He was calling me about the "weapons carry" in the restaurant, apparently returning my call-in from Monday during the period when I wasn't able to get a hold of anybody within his department. He was more open to trying to relay my wish to talk with the deputy's supervisor, and he offered that an informal report was the best way to get an immediate disciplinary response. I also asked for the forms to open an official complaint, should I not hear back from the deputies' supervisor.
At his point I am not sure that my decision to file an informal report was correct or that it will yield any improvements in this deputy's behavior and attitude. I am also more than a little concerned that the department has not, to date, wanted to share their procedure concerning how and why and when they consider it appropriate to approach an open-carry citizen without a reasonable suspicion of criminal behavior.
