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11 dead, 6 injured after shooting at the Virginia Beach Municipal Center

Firearms Iinstuctor

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Jul 12, 2011
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3,163
Location
northern wis
As pointed there is no shall dispose of the records. I have known many FFL holders I have yet to have one say they destroy there old records.

Buying and selling guns is not illegal in all states.

Some states put a lot of restrictions on that activity.

Some states like Wis. do not.

Buying and selling them on a regular basics for profit requires a FFL.

Occasional sales are exempt in most states and by federal law unless shipping them across state lines.
The receiving party in the other state has to be a FFL holder.
 

solus

Regular Member
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here nc
No the law says they can be destroyed after a period of time no supposed to there.

It is not a gun registry it is just used to track guns used in criminal activity.

And a BJ is not sex.

The sale of guns in the free market place is the check value to stopping a gun registry.
Buying and selling firearms on the open market is a patriotic thing to do.

That is why the anti's push so hard for so called universal back ground checks.
As pointed there is no shall dispose of the records. I have known many FFL holders I have yet to have one say they destroy there old records.

Buying and selling guns is not illegal in all states.

Some states put a lot of restrictions on that activity.

Some states like Wis. do not.

Buying and selling them on a regular basics for profit requires a FFL.


Occasional sales are exempt in most states and by federal law unless shipping them across state lines.
The receiving party in the other state has to be a FFL holder.
Not once FI, but twice and in less that two hours, you waffled changing your position on the mis-information you were posting in this thread as well as abrogating forum mandates by not providing one iota of cite, thus providing substantiation, to your mis-information epistles.

Some states, not illegal in all states, in most states, by federal law?
 

Firearms Iinstuctor

Regular Member
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3,163
Location
northern wis
So what isn't factual.

A FFl holder can dispose of records that reach a certain age. They do not have to.

Private sales are legal in most states.

There are states that restrict sales more then others.

Sales between states are required by law to go to through a FFL.

Seems simple enough sorry that some can't understand theses.
 

solus

Regular Member
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here nc
So what isn't factual.

A FFl holder can dispose of records that reach a certain age. They do not have to.

Private sales are legal in most states.

There are states that restrict sales more then others.

Sales between states are required by law to go to through a FFL.

Seems simple enough sorry that some can't understand theses [sic]
Certainly seems simple enough but do you have a cite for any of your mis-information you have posted today ~ if not it isn't factual!

Federal law states FFLs may not destroy their 4473s but maintain them for 20 years.

If the FFL is going out of business or the 4473s are over 20 years olde then the documents must be sent to ATF's warehouse!

Which states are private sales mostly legal?

Which states restrict sales more than others?

Which law(s) requires sales between states to go through a FFL?

ya, dog gone it FI seems simple enough, truly sorry you can't seem to even grasp these basic concepts!
 

Firearms Iinstuctor

Regular Member
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Messages
3,163
Location
northern wis
If you have questions about any states firearm law do the research your self.

I am not doing it for you.

If you can not understand the difference between most and mostly I suggest you find a dictionary.
 
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solus

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here nc
If you have questions about any states firearm law do the research your self.

I am not doing it for you.

If you can not understand the difference between most and mostly I suggest you find a dictionary.
But of course FI, of course...there’s just this itty bitty sticking point...

I didn’t make the most/mostly or some or other type generalized statements to the readership to mislead nor did I ignore, this:

5) CITE TO AUTHORITY: If you state a rule of law, it is incumbent upon you to try to cite, as best you can, to authority. Citing to authority, using links when available,is what makes OCDO so successful. An authority is a published source of law that can back your claim up - statute, ordinance, court case, newspaper article covering a legal issue, etc.

Tis a shame to see you resort to such blatant use of nonspecific & unspecified rhetoric as your past contributions have been exemplary and insightful.
 
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OC for ME

Regular Member
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Jan 6, 2010
Messages
11,998
Location
White Oak Plantation
I once talked to a guy that new a guy that heard about a guy that heard that there were three guys that had a buddy system. They supposedly would each buy a gun they didn't particularly like. After six or eight months they would sell their regretted purchase, if you know what I mean.
Is there some minimum amount of time after a purchase from a FFL before you can sell a unwanted firearm to another private LAC?
 

OC for ME

Regular Member
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White Oak Plantation
...

Tis a shame to see you resort to such blatant use of nonspecific & unspecified rhetoric as your past contributions have been exemplary and insightful.
Except for Firearms Instructor's post where he agrees with cops using the "high crime area" canard so that those cops can abuse a citizen and violate his rights without clear and unquestionable evidence of a crime having been committed. If a few bad actors abuse a citizen, every now and then, that is OK as long as we can catch a alleged perp before he becomes a actual perp.

See post #11
edit to correct spelling.
 
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solus

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here nc
Alas the savior of VA...

Virginia Gov. Ralph Northam is summoning state lawmakers for a special session on gun-control, saying Friday's mass shooting in Virginia Beach calls for "votes and laws, not thoughts and prayers."

 

TFred

Regular Member
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Oct 13, 2008
Messages
7,736
Location
Most historic town in, Virginia, USA
A private citizen cannot buy a firearm with the intention to make a profit.
Hmm, I'm not sure that is true. I'm not aware of any strict definition of where that line is. If I am in a pawn shop and I see a steal of a deal, and buy it, not because I want the gun for myself, but because I simply realize it is a steal... and then 6 months later I find someone who is interested in buying it... I don't know of anything that says that violates the law.

The whole regulatory scheme in this area is fatally flawed, but it is where we are now I guess.

TFred
 

color of law

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Oct 7, 2007
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4,711
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
Alas the savior of VA...

Virginia Gov. Ralph Northam is summoning state lawmakers for a special session on gun-control, saying Friday's mass shooting in Virginia Beach calls for "votes and laws, not thoughts and prayers."

So, Northam is upset that the killer didn't first get a license to kill like Planned Parenthood?
 

solus

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Aug 22, 2013
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here nc
A private citizen cannot buy a firearm with the intention to make a profit.
The truth, you know I have looked and looked in, under, beside your post and missed your cite to authority for the statement you posted?

But knowing your distain for this member, but allow me to assist in a clarification, therefore...

[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and (5), 922(d), 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30]
A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law.

Darn ya notice the pesky ATF failed or didn’t mention anything about selling for profit or loss, but business 101 says America’s entrepreneurial economic infrastructure is centered around PROFIT!

Might check ATF Publication 5310.2 January 2016.
 
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The Truth

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Jul 18, 2014
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1,969
Location
Henrico
Draw your own conclusions. I have drawn mine, and others seem to agree. ATF guidelines and Federal statute use somewhat vague language, in my opinion purposely so, in regards to what it means to be "in the business of" selling firearms, or selling "for profit." Anecdotal as some instances may be, personally, I err on the side of caution. As always, YMMV and IANAL.

"Courts have identified several factors relevant to determining on which side of that line your activities may fall, including: whether you represent yourself as a dealer in firearms; whether you are repetitively buying and selling firearms; the circumstances under which you are selling firearms; and whether you are looking to make a profit. Note that while quantity and frequency of sales are relevant indicators, courts have upheld convictions for dealing without a license when as few as two firearms were sold, or when only one or two transactions took place, when other factors were also present."

Emphasis mine.

Source: https://www.atf.gov/file/100871/download

@OC for ME apologies if I misunderstood your question.
 

gutshot II

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2017
Messages
602
Location
Central Ky.
That's not for me to explain. I'm sure a Commonwealth Attorney or prosecutor would happily oblige you in the case of any confusion in court.
I have to ask you since you are the only person that I have ever heard said anything close to that. Everybody else seems aware that "intentions" are almost impossible to discern. Hell, a lot of people that intend to make a profit are unable to do so. Would they also be guilty?
 
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